with all these new skills coming..

is there plans on raising the skill cap to 700?
or making skills less reliant on GM?
thinkin' about a Rogue with these 2 new spells coming, but i already have Lockpicking, Stealth, hiding, Vigor, Healing, Piercing, where do these 2 new seemingly Mandatory rogue abilities fit in?

Comments

  • They fit into the gap made by wiping lockpicking and healing.
  • MograMogra US
    edited November 23
    I think it makes sense that a thief would be gimped the same way a gatherer is gimped. You’re basically a gatherer, only of coin purses and other stolen resources. If you could steal, lock-pick, heal, and fight, then you might as well just kill them and take their loot that way. Thieves are usually cowardly non-combatants anyway, right?

    You could always try Stealing, Snooping, Hiding, Stealth, and add piercing+MP. Heal with potions, food, and kindling.

    Hell, now I’m going to have to try that..
  • basically the problem with 600 skill is - its an even number, you wont ever get character variation with even numbers, you get Build A and you get build B. when you set it at an uneven threshold you get build variation (build A, Build A2 Builds B, Build B2). there's still good and bad builds, boring and fun, except there's variations on them so you can bridge the gap between them. if you play any combat without mana usage, you're obligate to get Healing, Vigor, Martial Prowess. that's half of your skill pool off the hop. if you're a mage its 4 skills off the hop. where does the build variation come in? the type of weapon i use? there's no option for Hybrid, the more skills they add while keeping this at 600 is just going to make more skills unused collecting dust in that book. as the Net pool increases the base pool needs to as-well or you have Power Creep. i would say every 10 skills you add, you bump the cap up 100. or just succumb to power-creep before the games even stable..
  • edited November 23
    That bit about odd or even makes... no sense. You're saying we wouldn't have character variation with an 800 skill cap. To be fair, increasing the skill cap beyond a certain number will also start to reduce character variation. I wouldn't protest a 700 cap, but I can manage on 600.
    As you later mention, it is really about spare skill points left after base skills areassigned. Essentially, a trade off needs to be acheived. Having skills split 20/80 or 60/40 etc gives players a choice of what use they extract from a particular skill. It is up to CS to make that a viable system.
    In reality a low cap just means needing more accounts to be able to play all styles.
  • the odds evens thing is really hard to explain unfortunately for me, and the only reason i use it is because the skill cap is basically 6, not 60, not 600. im hard pressed to find many people who aren't GM in 6 skills.
    so if we use this (terrible example, but its all i can quickly find) https://legendsofariawiki.com/Build you can look at the "builds" available, it looks nice and wide at first glance, but then you peruse through it and read the skills they require, 33 out of 53 builds require healing and Vigor, 28 require Manifestation, channeling and 22 of the 28 have Evocation, 19 have Martial Prowess. 33+28+22+19 = 102 combinations use a variation of 3-4 of these 5 skills. and this is just some ruff maffs, what happens when "necromancy" comes around, and you need summoning as well as some way to control the undead.. you either need to make some of the secondary skills (martial Prowess, Magic affinity) not require 100 or we gotta boost this up to 700 so people can then choose to become a stealth mage, or a shaman/druid, not quite super strong as if they had 800 skill point to get like, the full mage skill and all stealth skill, or full melee/armor skill and full Animal taming skill, but 700 then offers everyone the option to chose perhaps Healing/vigor @ 50/50, or having some form of combat skill on a crafter/gatherer. and these options i listed are available, yes. but you don't see them on this "build" list for a reason. it would be a waste of your time. idk image
  • I think it really comes down to Healing/Vigor. I mentioned this in my own thread, too. Healing and Vigor are almost essential for every build, and required for Fighting. FIGHTING.

    They need to change those Skills so they’re not a necessity. No Skill should be required to be viable and that’s more or less of what Healing/Vigor does to the game. Unless you’re a true Healer, it makes 0 sense that 2 Skills should be required by a Fighter.

    With those gone or with Martial Prowess adding some ability to regain health, your options making a hybrid or spreading out Skills selection would greatly increase, even with 600 Skill point max.
  • Hybrids are DOA they have already stated they do not want build diversity due to fear of power creep or "One builds to Rulez them All"

    Dont get me wrong I agree with there being a skill point cap issue and some skills like healing/vigor etc being way to mandatory.
  • MograMogra US
    edited November 24
    Diamonas said:

    Hybrids are DOA they have already stated they do not want build diversity due to fear of power creep or "One builds to Rulez them All"

    Interesting. I guess that explains why they bundled Healing/Vigor into the Fighting Profession. Sadly, I don’t see this changing either because from the info I gathered they (CS) likes the design of Healing/Vigor as a means for a non-Mage to heal, even though it is remarkably basic in design.

    With Bloodlust acting like a Melee Spell Book, now more than ever Healing could use a retune. Imagine a mode where dealing melee damage caused you to heal, or a drain life ability for like a Dragon Age style Reaver who gains a damage bonus and resistances as they near death. Or another Bloodlust ability that heals you over time for X% of Health and consumes Bloodlust.
  • edited November 25
    Nobody is disputing that some systems are quite basic atm, but it's still EA and fixing non-broken skills is not a priority. Once all the ancient bugs are squished, the UI brought up to standard & finalised content released, then we can start harassing CS to make LoA the complex maze of builds we want. Ideas posted here, now, will be lost in the fog of time...
  • I would argue that EA is the perfect time to change, experiment, and retune, as well as adding as much as possible to the game before polishing and fine tuning it. Not to mention optimization.

    The gameplay is the backbone of the game and it needs to feel fun first. Then focus on new content, which no matter what is going to bring new bugs. I’ve come across A LOT so far on experimental, many I’ve never experienced in all my time playing Live.

    Don’t get me wrong, if all P8 featured was a retune on skills/abilities, I imagine you’d hear many groans from this community. But hopefully the feedback provided by us does not get taken as harassing nor get lost in the fog of time. This games got so much potential and I’m sure most of us just want to see it reach it.
  • RavenHarvesterRavenHarvester United States
    I thought the one build to rule all in PVP was healing mage and the one build to rule all in PVE was Bard tamer ? So I guess technically two builds rule all depending on what your focus .
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